Everton
FC E-mails 221 - Stadium Special (4)
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Whatever
you think e-mail your views to info@bluekipper.com
We have had hundreds of mails on the proposed Stadium Move. We will put them on the site over the next few days Belly Up I’ve accepted that we need to move from Goodison. It seems obvious we can’t re-develop the old girl, since the council won’t let us. But I for one can see the Kirkby idea going belly up. Even looking at it from a fiscal point of view, the vast majority of Everton fans are adult men who like a pint before and after the game. Piss them off by moving to Kirkby and you risk losing at least 10,000 season ticket holders and to be honest, I fully expect that this could in fact be up to 10,000 higher in reality. So not only would we be moving into a ground with a capacity already 20,000 seats higher that our average attendance, (35,000 av attendance versus 55,000 potential capacity) but we risk making that 30,000. So we’re told it’s only 4 miles as the crow flies (By road it’s 6 miles incidentally) and this will increase the likelihood of Everton fans from that catchment area coming to the game. Really? Well why did they never come to Goodison? It’s only 4 miles further, as the crow flies – which strikes the question, when people say what kind of fan are you for stopping going to the match because we moved to Kirkby, what kind of fans would make the trip to Kirkby more often than they ever did Goodison? Not to mention that a move to Kirkby would be, as one shareholder said, “raising the white flag and telling the dirty red bastards that they have the city” – or something like that. In some families, kids are given a choice of who they want to support – who are they going to choose? Not only that, but no one can honestly believe that they will replace, in volume, the number of fans who will drop off because of moving to Kirkby? And the corporate fans? Any lads out there who’ve been to away grounds on comps will no not a peep is made in those corporate areas, because they’re made up of loads of away fans, so they hardly add to the atmosphere. (Of course, that could just be because Evertonians get everywhere, no matter what ground you’re at and it might not be like that with other teams) My rational here is not that we shouldn’t move – Goodison, as much as I love the old girl, is dated now. But that we shouldn’t move to Kirkby too hastily. The problem of course is we’re not the club in this city that the council want to bend over backwards to help. I’ve got no problem with Kirkby itself, I’m sure it’s great there and that it would really benefit greatly from the redevelopment, but it will benefit from a large Tesco built there regardless of whether the club is attached. If we move to Kirkby, I’ll still go. There’s no point in me pretending I won’t, I will just get sucked again in after a while, so for me, why fight the inevitable. But I’d not even be thinking about this if the move was to another site in the city. I’m not even FROM Liverpool, I’m a Welsh extradite, but even I can see it’s wrong to leave the city boundaries. For me, the sense is not just looking to improve the club as a business, but remembering who it was that kept this club going through the toughest of times and doing what is right by them, because without them, the club could well have been dead and buried a long time ago. Nicholas Hughes. (19/12/06) Reserving My Judgment I myself will be waiting until kenwright has said we are definitely moving to kirkby before laying my cards on the table. By saying we are "investigating" a move to kirkby Bill is throwing down the gauntlet to LCC who said they will do everything in their power to keep us in the city. He wants them to offer us a better or equal deal. if two equal offers were on the table (liverpool or kirkby) were do you think he would want to go. Heno. (19/12/06) It's gotten to the point where I need to vent my views on the somewhat flawed thinking of how a new stadium will allow us to "compete" with the big three (plus The Shite) and that the move is somehow "inevitable". What proof is there that switching stadiums will provide us the catalyst to success? Are Middlesboro, Sunderland, Bolton, Man City, etc being overwhelmed by trophy winning success? Let us examine 'the contenders'. Man Utd, despite being the most financially successful club in the world, have taken the decision to stay at and redevelop Old Trafford to keep up with the demand from their fans, demand generated by continual footballing success. Arsenal, all their recent glories that propelled them to be the biggest most fashionable club in London were achieved at Highbury, another old restricted view stadium; that Highbury was too small to cope with their fan base was of no consequence to the success of the team that played in the stadium. When Arsene Wenger arrived Arsenal were scratching around with us for a UEFA cup spot, he has built them up, created the success and because of that the fan base has burgeoned and they genuinely needed to move to maximise on this. Perhaps if Arsenal had persisted with Bruce Rioch and we had got Wenger in we would be at the King's Dock as we speak? The Shite have won what they've won at Analfield, nowadays the huge amount of Norweigans using budget airlines to travel to their matches means the demand for tickets is well in-excess of Kopite capacity and this is why they feel the need for an extravagant new stadium, but again let's highlight the serious point that it is the increasing fan base that makes this a necessity. Chelsea, inspite of having all the money in the world and spending £400 odd million on players since Roman arrived, have been strangely muted in their calls for a new stadium, why?, perhaps because it is obvious that a stadium has bugger all to do with generating success, it is down to a rich enthusiastic chairman prepared to put his hand in his pocket…he probably realises that moving from their spiritual home would be the only thing he could do wrong in the eyes of the Chelsea faithful Look further down south for even further evidence of a 'fools gold' belief that a stadium will bring success. Harry Redknapp leaves crap stadium Pompey to manage flashy-new-stadium-and-obviously-on-the-up-Southampton, Southampton get relegated and lo and behold Pompey get snapped up by a rich Russian and before you can say "loyalty" Redknapp is back at Pompey. Do we have a huge prawn sandwich eating fan-base? Is there a 5-10 year waiting list to get a season ticket at Goodison? Even excluding restricted view from the argument, do we sell-out all out all matches at Goodison? I think you will find the answer to all these questions is no. I've seen it written that having our new stadium will somehow make us more attractive to a new investor, again where is the evidence? Villa Park, comparable to Goodison, was no barrier to the Randy Lerner takeover, why?…I'll tell you, it's because Villa had good business fundamentals which can be considered to be low debt and good, if not great, off-field management. I imagine the aforementioned Pompey were the same. So how will the creation of a colossal new debt in the shape of a new stadium suddenly make us a viable investment for your average billionaire investor who wants his first £100 million to be spent on better players and not on servicing debt? The formula for success involves getting your house in order on and off the pitch, this will then attract an enthusiastic rich person, to buy the club. The stadium you play in has little to no bearing on this. Moyesy has us moving in the right direction on the pitch, I truly believe Billy and Bully are doing the best that they can off it, so if the current rate of billionaires/super-rich entering English football continues it surely won't be too long before we are plucked off the shelf as it were. The new stadium has every chance of being a hindrance to this opportunity occurring. Forgetting these financial and evidential arguments, there is also the feeling that if our Tescodrome gets built it will be nothing more than an IKEA flat pack, anonymous "A stadium" a la The Riverside, Reebok. Tesco's are your typical ruthless corporation and they will want costs kept to a minimum - shareholders and all that. With our current financial situation and the input we will be able to offer i'm 100% certain any new stadium we build will be less Emirates and more Eastlands. In comparison the Shite do seem to have attracted an enthusiastic billionaire who no-doubt will be able to embellish their stadium with details such as Norweigan herrings engraved on the seats and Middle Eastern domes on every corner to make their fans feel at home, putting us even further in the shade. We can counter this by remaining at Goodison. The history it represents and it's importance to Liverpool cannot and should not be under-estimated, we are the original City of Liverpool club and that will not and cannot be taken away by the Shite's fandangled new 'sporting arena' , remember…They don't build 'em like they used to! Also with the move to Kirkby there is the feeling that The Shite will have chased us out of Liverpool, it is only the tiniest distance geographically, but it's significance really should be obvious even to the most pro-new stadium fan. It can be glossed over, but I can't believe anyone is truly happy with that part of the proposal. Other subjective arguments for staying such as loss of atmosphere, etc are just that, subjective, so I will leave them out so as not to cheapen my opinion. I would not want to stand in the way of a move if I genuinely thought there would be a significant benefit to our beloved club, but I just can't see it. This whole episode looks like a desperate rush to 'keep up with the Jones'', and far from benefiting Everton it could actually hurt us in the long term. We turn our back on our heritage at a risk far greater than putting the noses of a few sentimentalists out of place. Mike, London. (19/12/06) Finance The Key I am a 41 year old season ticket holder of many years and fear this could be the nail in the coffin for me. I'm already disillusioned with the sky soap opera of football that we now have to live with, sick of Sunday/Monday games, sick of armchair non fans telling me the rights and wrongs of the games I've paid money to watch, sick of the elite clubs monopoly of trophy's and money. A great part of being an Evertonian and going the match for me has been the social aspect, meeting mates on a SATURDAY in the pubs on County Road ranting on about the blues (it's the only chance I get cos me missus wont listen to me). Goodison still gives me a buzz, I have a great seat and it's a great venue for footie, maybe not great for it's hot food selection & drinks (but I go to a pub or restaurant for them). It's not that I'm against change as I would have been all for the King's Dock arena but this new idea of a soulless, shopping mall stadium leaves me empty. Can't see me going all the way to Kirby on Sunday service for a sky dictated 4pm ko somehow, and I'm died in the heart blue who got wed at Goodison, and if I lose faith then my 2 kids (under 3) may well be lost to the future generation of fans. I personally won't believe that any new ground venture is for real until the last brick is in place especially with EFC's finances. Andy E. (19/12/06) No To Kirkby I think moving to Kirkby will be a major mistake. I have been a season holder for 8 seasons and I think season ticket holders should have a say in the matter, we are the peoples club from Liverpool, if the shite can get a ground in this city when all that is watching them is foreigners then so can we!!!. NEW GROUND YES . KIRKBY NOOOOO. CAROLYN TOWNLEY. (19/12/06) Move On My
12 old son and myself went to watch the Blues at Old Trafford (Stretford
end) a couple of weeks ago, and where taken back by the ground Having
read the many many mails is this and other sites regarding the moving
to Kirkby, I feel that we are missing the point. As an expat in Europe
I don't get to many matches, which will negate my view for many of the
luddites. I watch the blues religiously every week and our family discussions
are dominated by player/club issues. The biggest issue for me is what
if we don't move. Ten years ago the Euro championships came to Liverpool,
Everton THE club of Merseyside was overlooked, the games went to them.
We have been overtaken by the likes of Bolton, Middlesborough and Sunderland
for representative games. Bill Kenwright has done a great scene painting
job, but I have never once been to Goodison and been lifted by the stadium,
the team, the fans but never the stadium. I have however been angered
and frustrated by the stadium, queues, concessions, obstructed views and,
of course problems getting in and out of the ground. Know Your History Why
are there so many negative comments about moving, we do sing "IF
YOU KNOW UR HISTORY" Knowsley council This morning I heard on the radio that Steven Gerrard's been presented the 'Key to the Borough' by Knowsley council. Does this mean that when we get our shiny new stadium, at any time he chooses, Gerrard will be able to walk in and take a dump in the centre circle? Why do these council officials continue to take the piss out of us? Drew. (19/12/06) New Ground?? Having read through the new emails that have been submitted onto our Everton website, it is clear that some people have disagreed with my original letter. However the only people who do actually want this ground move to happen are from the likes of Shropshire, Lancashire, North Wales, Ireland, Isle of Man or previously from Kirkby (who in-turn moved away to London). Of course they don’t mind about boundaries, neither do the people from Bolton (relocated stadium) or Man U (again relocated stadium), which is why they don’t realise what it is actually like to be a Scouser and have that pride. Anyone from Liverpool would claim they are first and foremost a Scouser, rather than English or indeed British. Liverpool can be compared to Barcelona in numerous ways, especially the way they separate themselves from Spain using the tag Catalonians. This is the reason why us Scousers are getting so touchy about 4 miles. It’s a matter of principle that we should not be forced out of the city. Graeme Adams. (19/12/06) Move Or Not Move This is the 3rd Season I’ve now had a season ticket and before that I came to Goodison as often as I could, I'm not a Scouser and I don’t live in Liverpool, I'm from Mansfield near Nottingham, I have to Travel a good 5-6 hrs there and back per home game to watch the team I love, and I go to numerous away games, Middlesborough being the last. Anyway enough about me, I think the Club’s future is the priority, if this means moving 4 miles down the road then so be it – its not like where doing a Wimbledon, But id rather Goodison be updated like Old Trafford as been done rather than move to an concrete block like the Arsenal have done. However that doesn’t seem to be an option, and i know Goodison is Outdated now and is no longer a top class venue, has numerous faults, however its our home and id just love to stay there, but could we afford to lose several thousands off the gates as redevelopment is being done. People speak about the regeneration it will do to Kirby, as anybody discussed the damage it will do to the area surrounding Goodison, what about the people whose income relies on Everton’s Home Game’s, are there future’s even being considered. Also where are the wealthy Everton Fans like Paul McCartney when there needed, I'm sure instead of losing all is money to Heather “I really did love him” Mills, he could stick some in the club now or even help promote our case to stay in the city. All in all I don’t really have a point, I just like to add my views to what is a good debate to both sides. Ian Sutton. (19/12/06) Consider The Juventus (Delle Alpi) Case A few seconds should be given to consider what has happened to Juventus & their stadium (Delle Alpi). In 1990, as part of the world cup, Juventus moved into a brand new, state of the art ground. The stadium had, initially, a capacity of 70,040, with easy transport links for the fans. Everything sounds great. But, the stadium was built OUTSIDE of the city. With the travel times & lack of amenities around the stadium supporter numbers started to dwindle, with one cup game attracting only 237 (yes, two hundred & thirty seven, no misprint!). The circumstances with Everton are obviously different. The cup games in Italy aren’t taken too seriously, there will be a Tesco & a couple of pubs around Kirkby & Everton fans are great. Personally I think a ground move would be good fro the club, but should it go outside the city boundaries? I don’t think so. “Build it and they will come” might have worked for Kevin Costner, but will it work for Bill Kenwright& Co? Andy Macrae. (19/12/06) IS KIRKBY REALLY A BAD OPTION? Evertonians everywhere. I feel i should make a point about the proposed ground move to Kirkby. I watched Everton for years, home and away, and i believe Goodison lost its passion and sense of invisibility as soon as we had to SIT DOWN ( we all know why ).I'm a wool from St Helens and as far as I've always been concerned, Kirkby is in Liverpool, they all speak with scouse accents, have an 'L' postcode and hate Mancs, so what's the problem? I've worked in Kirkby for 30 yrs and try telling the Kirkbyites that they're not scousers!. . . We could always move the new ground to St Helens. . . Now that would cause a stir . . . We could share with the greatest rugby team ever! Joking apart, think about it, IS KIRKBY REALLY A BAD OPTION? Mark. ST HELENS. (19/12/06) I love the Club, everything else is a bonus I don't normally write into the site, just read while I'm at work, but this is getting ridiculous. I'm not a scouser, I don't pretend to be one, nor have I ever lived in Liverpool. I grew up in North Wales and I love Everton Football Club. I don't know why, I just do. I have no reason to love them so much, no connection to the club, but for as long as I can remember I have supported the Greatest Football Club on Earth. I can understand all the concern regarding moving outside of the city boundary, but it's time to move on. From what I understand the postcode of the proposed Kirkby site is L33, L means something doesn't it??!! So
what if it's 2 or 3 miles outside of the 'city'. Any club wanting to progress
is going to move stadium and take on some sort of investment but What the fuck have we achieved in the past 15 years? FUCK ALL, We've been shite and it's only now that we have begun to stabalise and slowly improve. We all know that moving to a new stadium is inevitable for us to progress further. If we move to Kirkby, so be it. I'm not saying I'm all for the proposed move but I love the club, I support the club and no matter where they play this will never waver!!!! Great Site lads....Jase (Coventry) (19/12/06) What Do You Think? Have your say! e-mail info@bluekipper.com |