Kirkby
Move
Lets
face it, the Kirkby move is only to do with ackers, muller, geld etc
- Money Nothing else
We go to Kirkby and we get the land and stadium for next to nothing
courtesy of Knowsley BC and Tesco
Tesco need a reason to build a superstore there and Everton are that
reason - They also get to name it I suppose
Kirkby desperately need the investment and to change their advertising
boards on the M57 from "home of QVC" (for F^%*" sake)
to Home of "Everton FC"
We stay in the City and we have to pay (big time), as there is already
to many Tesco's and other superstores there, and so they wouldn't assist.
I'm undecided personally, and its forums like this that help form your
opinion, but I know that the club see Kirkby as a near on free dinner,
as oppose to zillions having to be found to fund a stadium elsewhere,
so Its difficult to criticise them too harshly, after all we don't have
Russian Romans at the helm.
Personally I despise Liverpool City council and all that they stand
for.
I would desist having anything to do with them in the bat of an eyelid,
as they are so openly bias to the shite it is unbelievable
I am absolutely sure that if we had proposed a move into stanley park
we would have been summarily knobbed off , as we are a low priority
to them
They don't give shit about Everton, and have their sights on the throngs
of Ryan air flights and national express coaches that pull into our
city on every analfield match day
And also whilst I am not a tree hugger, I find it sickening that once
again a concrete development has to take the place of one of the limited
bits of green stuff our city has to offer (like the festival site).
They build on the parks and then throw 3 thousand signs up saying "no
ball games" in the street - Fucking hypocrites
I don't accept the Kirkby is out of the city, its as much liverpool
as Bootle and Crosby (sefton), and your a brave person to call someone
from these place a woolyback.
I do accept that there will be a culture change, as having been to the
new stadia around the country, if you like your pre and post match laugh
with the lads, then its sadly missing from Bolton, Boro etc
However, Kirkby would not be as remote as these other grounds, and the
opportunist scousers will have several watering holes built before you
can say "last orders" on County road.
As I say I'm really undecided and dithering on the issue - Story of
my life. But one thing is for sure - Its only through forums like this
that opinions will shape judgement. I for one only ever listen to other
Evertonians where the club is concerned. I learnt a long long time ago
not to pay a blind bit of notice or at least be extremely skeptical
to any statements that ever comes out of the boardrooms Goodison Park.
Cheers & COYB
Blueboybrian. (26/02/07)
Kirkby
isn't the issue!
Firstly
I'm aware that Kirkby is as scouse as a brown mixed and it's geographical
location says it would be a good place to build a stadium, but get wise
lads......The only reason we're talking about Kirkby is because it's
Bill Kenwright's only option. Leahy needs a Tesco's in Kirkby and we
can play in the car park.
Whether
you're a fan of Kenwright or not is not important. But the facts are
he hasn't got the finance to progress the club. That's not Kenwright's
fault of course. But before we talk about moving the club from it's
home for over 100 years, then he has to do everything in his power to
see if there is anyone who can take us forward and give us another option...ie
redevelop our home.
If
Kenwright went on Sky Sports News and other media outlets, stood up
and said.... "I haven't the finance to progress the club and I
know there are people out there who want to buy in to football as the
deals from clubs who are small by comparison at Portsmouth, West Ham
and Villa have proved. And providing the deal was right for both me
and the club, I will sell"......then if there were no offers (and
I think there would be many), he would have every right in saying..."right
there's no sugar daddy and you're stuck with me and this is the way
it has to be".....and no body could argue. But
until he says something like that, then support for him will always
be divided, The Chris Samuelson, Kings Dock and the 'he's not for sale
even at £50m' will always cloud peoples opinion of him.
I
want to see Everton successful again like we all do. I want to see Bill
Kenwright who is undoubtedly a great fan of the club sitting in the
front
row of the Main Stand cheering us on. But sadly for us, under BK it
wont happen. This isn't a Kenwright rant, this is just and impartial
view of a
blue who has been watching us for nearly 40 years, who is looking a
bit further than the spin. Billy.
(26/02/07)
Below
Goodison
Just
regarding the stadium issue and the redevelopment of goodison, I was
thinking about the Nou Camp, and how they built the stadium. The Nou
Camp pitch is actually around 8 metres below ground level, so wouldn't
it be possible to redevelop Goodison with this in mind. Our stadium
obviously wouldn't be 98,000 like the Nou Camp, but any redevelopment
of Goodison could minimise space by lowering the pitch and so stand
space wouldn't need
to be so large. Or
maybe i just don't have a clue what I'm talking about and this isn't
possible.....haha Great site guys, keep up the good work. Gaz.
(26/02/07)
I'm
not going to Kirkby
We will end up just like oldham, stockport, bolton etc, not quite manchester.
If only a quarter of our support feel like me, then the situation is
lost. I REPEAT, if Everton go to kirkby they will be dead to me and
thousands of others. Ste Mac. (26/02/07)
Ground
Move
What’s
this bollocks? I thought they said they didn’t want to move out of Liverpool?
I’d rather stay in Goodison. Dowelly. (26/02/07)
New
Stadium: Report on FC Cologne's Rhein Energie Stadium
In
regard to Ian McDonald's comments on
the possibility of the (proposed) new stadium being modelled on the
Rhein Energie Stadium where FC Koln play, I'd just like to comment that
I was in that very stadium recently for their home match against Carl
Zeiss Jena which they won 1-0.
The first thing that struck me was that there is a frequent tram service
right to the stadium a few miles outside the city centre. The stadium
itself is rectangular, with no problems at all in terms of sightlines-
capacity of around 48, 000 , I think. As far as access/facilities were
concerned , the design aspects were very good -wide asiles , well spaced
seating, spacious open areas beneath the stands with stalls to buy your
beer and food. Toilets were of a far better standard , or course, than
those we've suffered at Goodison. All in all, the Rhein Energie had
the feel of a very spacious, modern arena ,with a really good atmosphere
- I hope Ian is right , as I for one would love to watch the Blues in
a theatre like this. Oh yes, one other thing. They serve you ale at
your seat in your refillable plastic beer mug. Bring on the Chang !
I would encourage any fans with a few bob and a blank weekend to fly
cheapo to Germany and take in a game as i does open oyur eyes a bit
as to what can be achieved. Nearby Dusseldorf is a good night out. Neil
Mc Farlane, Harrogate Blue.
(26/02/07)
Don't
do it Bill 2
Again,
another decent article by one of the most informed Evertonians you're
ever likely to meet. We all have our opinions and I for one will sit
up and listen to his. Quick point with this, FC Koln http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RheinEnergie_Stadion
has a museum in it's North stand, a la Deepdale, a fitting home for
the Dave France Collection I would say and much better than prawn sarnie
corporate boxes. Keep the faith.
Rich Welsh Blues.
(26/02/07)
Brilliant
Mickey, brilliant
I've
just read MBE's article on the existing
site plan of Goodison and it was brilliant and very clear. I can't
see how a new good stadium can fit into the existing site plan after
seeing the effect of the GFE plan on it. You still need to get those
houses and everything else before you can do anything unless someone
can show otherwise.
I also visited the web site address he gave for the GFE, and then I
looked up http://www.wardmchugh.demon.co.uk/page4.htm
the web site of the architects named by the GFE. There's no mention
of the Patrick Clancy mentioned by Frank
Hargreaves, but that doesn't matter one way or the other, because
it's the plan used by the GFE and Ward Mchugh and put up on the internet
that counts. It was supposed to show you could get a stadium into the
existing site plan, but it doesn't. The Ward Mchugh stadium design looks
like an IKea flat pack.
I don't know if Kirkby is the answer or not but I now know we can't
stay within the existing site plan, so it's either get all the other
land or move out. The sooner we get a new stadium the better, wherever
it is. Chris Roberts, Mossley Hill. (26/02/07)
Get
Out Of The 80's
I
can't believe the amount of people labeling Kirkby as "Woolyback
Land". Kirkby is undoubtedly a part of Liverpool - in fact, it
can be argued that
Kirkby is one of the last actual parts of "traditional" Liverpool
where the accent is undoubtedly pure scouse, we're all either red or
blue and nothing else, and we're all proud of our culture and heritage.
That doesn't
mean, however, that i'm necessarily in favour of the stadium being built
there. I'm from Kirkby myself and it has many, many problems as a place
of being. However, the site which is being discussed is undoubtedly
excellent for a stadium. It has brilliant potential in regards to traffic
access, the area is less "cramped" than Goodison and will
allow for an excellent stadium as well as, to be fair, being a more
attractive prospect to potential investors and players. Brilliant as
Goodison is, it can't be said to be great on the eye as a modern stadium
or its immediate surroundings.
The argument
that a Kirkby stadium would mean Everton losing its identity as a football
club is a decent one. The name "Everton" would definitely
no longer indicate where the club is situated, for example. But we have
such a rich history that as long as we're still in Liverpool as a city
and the
"scouseness" of the club and its atmosphere is maintained,
then we'll still be the same brilliant football club but with a kitted
out new stadium.
As far
as community benefits go, this will benefit Kirkby in obvious ways of
regeneration but also it'll benefit the area around Goodison currently
in existence. Tesco's motives aren't really questionable - they want
to make money. Big deal. They'll bring jobs to Kirkby whereas the current
stadium doesn't bring any to the local community - whatever jobs there
are will be maintained as its only a 10 minute train down to Kirkby
from Kirkdale station. The current pubs will be the only casualty but
that'd be the case no matter where we move.
I think
the majority of people recognise how practical a stadium move is, but
are afraid of change. Understandable, as there isn't a way back once
we've gone. The best way to go forward is to judge the plans on their
merits and back or throw out what they intend based on what they are
- not to simply dismiss it because of its location and the, dare I say
it, snobbiness of those located towards the city centre. There
isn't a viable alternative within the city "limits" as far
as a stadium is concerned and the expansion of Goodison is out of the
question due to the fact you'd have to literally tear down the place
and rebuild completely - and even then, the old problems of parking
etc. will stay. We
can't afford to be stuck in the 1980's - we need to move on. Lee.
(17/02/07)
Get
with the times
MONEY
makes the world go round! simple as. football is no different.Dont look
at the boro's' and sunderland's, they were poorly managed and were never
anything big anyway. Everton are a bigger club then those two combined
and the old lady is just not good enough to home us no more. the truth
is we should be back up there with the so called big 3 or 4, the reason
we are not is money. if the move to kirkby brings in the money then
who can complain. all this crap about it being outside the city boundaries
is bullsh*t. If anyone knows kirkby, it is the most scouse place in
liverpool. and the simple fact is, liverpool city council don't want
everton in liverpool. leave them to lick the shites arse!! A bigger
better stadium will bring in more money, better players which will eventually
transfer to an improvement on the pitch. so stop the moaning and lets
move on. IN MOYES WE TRUST!!! Jay Aintree (17/02/07)
I
love Everton and Goodison park
I love the streets and the pubs therein. but unless we want to meander
down the divisions playing in a museum, then we just have to move. if
we don't, I can see the scenario in fifteen (or maybe less) years where
we are playing bournemouth for real in front of crowds of less than
10,000 and wishing we could turn the clock back to the days when we
had the chance to build a new goodison. Lol Pedersen upper bullens
season ticket holder. (17/02/07)
Mickey
Wrong Eyes
How
I wished for his sake that the rumour I had heard that Michael had plans
to do a "hatchet job" on a near 10 year old redevelopment
plan was not to go ahead. How I also wished for his sake he wasn't going
to use plans that were neither submitted
to the club, nor used...by any party, including the GFE. Plans that
nobody has ever worked from in any meaningful discussion. How odd that
he should choose now to be so wrong on such a grand scale. The plans
he has worked from are a preliminary set of plans that were published
by a young lad called Patrick Clancy. They were taken from an interim
set of plans that were never submitted to anybody. Not the Club, not
the Council. What a great shame and waste of Michael's efforts. Perhaps
his time may have been better spent coming up with his own plans and
ideas for a redevelopment.He was warned that should he continue he will
make an absolute fool of himself because none of his assumptions would
be correct. Not one single one. He would in fact be starting from square
wrong and heading up wrong creek without a compass, paddle or come to
think of it... a canoe.
I
was also seized with incredulity when Terry Ward informed me he had
been inundated with mails from somebody called Mike Durkin "demanding"
that they release information and answer questions about work Ward McHugh
undertook for a private client (us) nine years ago. I am not sure what
the climate was like when Michael last picked up a pencil in anger but
I am sure client confidentiality existed then, just as much as it does
now. Good
Lord...
I
wish there was a quote I could put in here...but I'm not clever enough.
Very, very sad to also note that as usual he seizes upon the chance
to have yet another sly dig at any blue who doesn’t tow his line. I
am yet to read a more wrong piece on any issue. It couldn’t have happened
to a nicer guy. Cheers. Frank Hargreaves.
(17/02/07)
Mickey Blue Eyes
Very
good, excellent in fact. Keep it up. The truth will out. Rich
Welsh Blues. (17/02/07)
MBE
- Patronising As Ever
What
an excellent piece on behalf of Bill - spoken with an equal amount of
pomp, veracity and spin. Littered with detail, technological understanding
and pictures. Patronising as ever to the ordinary, paying fan, such
an appeal to the intelligencia ought to be framed for posterity. Peete.
(17/02/07)
Lets Go To Kirkby
I
can't believe the amount of arguing that is going on about our proposed
move to Kirkby. I am from Kirkby, although I have moved up to Geordie
land, I travel down every other week to watch the blues (Season Ticket
Holder Top Balc) What's the problem, everyone who is saying its outside
the cities boundaries, do me a favour, Kirkby still has an L postcode.
the move will generate massive income for Everton and Knowsley by creating
jobs etc. Also can I point out, where is Old Trafford, its not in Manchester
its in Salford, a different city!!! Talk about following the blues,
grow up lads and lasses, prove you r a true blue and back them, after
all I bet you will still go the match!!!! Great site lads. Inny.
(17/02/07)
Gwladys
Street
From
the look of the plans at the Goodison site, The Gwladys Street Stand
would be the new away supporters area. Have a look at the plans and
see if you agree. How would this go down with the Gwladys street faithful.Dar.
(17/02/07)
MBE
The
article by Mickey Blue Eyes will, hopefully,
do what it says on the tin and crush all the myths and half truths currently
doing the rounds about the protracted saga that is the new stadium and
it's proposed site.
Having read a lot of the submissions sent to your (great) site, I feared
the worst. Here we go, I thought, another long emotive rant about history,
atmosphere and going to the wild, remote and inaccessible land that
is Kirkby (described on some maps, apparently, with the legend "Here
Be Dragons").
But no, a well presented, reasonable stating of the facts. Thank goodness
for common sense and a realisation that a great club needs to move on
to recapture its former status as top dogs. Bernie Bluey.
(17/02/07)
Stadium
Just
thought i would respond to the M.B.E.s stadium
mania piece haven't really read it all but whatever happened to
the Goodison For EVERTON (G.F.E) plans remember printing it off a few
years back. I hope the club stays at goodison but we must have redevelopment
and those plans at the time looked ideal, great site lads keep it up
have been logging on for last 4 or 5 years at least and never let us
down on 1st rate news & info on our beloved club. COME ON YOU BLUES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Cheers, The Blue Budgie. (17/02/07)
DON’T
DO IT BILL!
They say desperate men do desperate things ,well I don’t know if Bill’s
desperate or having a moment of madness. I use to say to Bill he has
been out of the city too long and local pride and competitiveness is
not on a daily basis in London as it is here in the City regarding our
two major clubs. I’m talking about our propose move out to Kirkby. Cards
on the table here Kirkby has a Liverpool postcode and a hell of a lot
of my mates live there they are as Scouse as me but none of them want
the stadium on their door step. No matter how it will be spun most Evertonians
I know have a gut feeling that it is just plain wrong to move seven
miles out of the city centre whilst a new castle grey skull is planned
just a few hundred yards from our spiritual home. Like I said at the
last AGM (All Gone Mad!) if we move to the outskirts of the city then
it will be like unfurling the white flag to our red neighbours. The
city is yours now, like Red Indians driven from their homelands to the
barren outskirts.
When we
had our last proposed move to the Kings Dock every red I knew was gutted,
it was to be a quantum leap for our club on the fourth most famous waterfront
in the world. But sadly we never made it past the ‘show us your money
stage’ and Bill loved the power of leading the club more than giving
it over to that bad Mr Gregg to deliver this once in a life time opportunity
with his ‘reverse mortgage’. Ask yourself why was this location, deal
and stadium spec was not delivered when the council and RDA just wanted
a paltry thirty million from us? How gutted do you feel when you pass
the new concert arena on the Kings Dock now? This sad part of our present
custodian’s tenure will be an Albatross around their necks compared
to what they want to do now. Paul Wharton who comes from Kirkby said
to me “They promised us a penthouse on the waterfront now it’s a council
flat in Kirkby”! Now the reds are laughing at us, the mocking banners
at the last derby is just a taste of things to come. Sure ‘we don’t
care what the red half say what the hell do we care ‘,as the song goes
but deep down we do if you live amongst them whether it be at work,
in the school place or at the pub .And its not just banter now its bitter.
I just
can’t believe Bill is even considering the move to Kirkby after being
against it during Peter Johnson’s tenure to the point of helping the
Goodison for Everton campaigners. So what has changed Bill’s mind so
drastically? Is it because we are so skint to the point were we need
ANY handout to move on, it’s the only deal on the table? If Tesco’s,
our proposed partner and benefactor, were to say the location was to
be in Cronton do we move there? Point is, it's where Tesco want it.
Wherever they wanted a complex that's where we are going. EFC, so-called
BIG club dictated to by a supermarket chain. Sad as hell. Sold down
the river Alt by those running our club one fan said to me. I know we
only really own Goodison now, which is frightening when you consider
just how much property we had before True Blue Holdings took charge.
I find it disturbing that the people who are driving this proposed move
are either not Evertonians or live in excess of 200 miles from the city
so when they jump into their cars after the game the stadium could be
anywhere convenient to their personal plans. If we take a quick look
at the main players in this move it may give more of an insight as to
why were proposing to vacate the city.
Bill Kenwright, now I really think he would not harm
Everton deliberately and may be being led along or as I said before
having temporary madness. Maybe Bill’s had enough and wants an exit
strategy, who knows? Thing is now with Bill there is no one else to
blame ,that bad Mr Gregg has left and Peter Johnson has well gone so
he stands at the helm for any major decisions and accountable to Evertonians
during his tenure. It won’t be John Woods or Robert Earl blamed if this
venture out to Kirkby becomes a disaster it will lay firmly at the feet
of Bill when Evertonians reflect in years to come. I was as pleased
as the next Blue when he came to the helm ,our club needed him then
but now I reflect on what his tenure has brought and its sadly a hell
of a lot of debt and undelivered promises .His ‘divorce’ from a friendship
of more than twenty years with Paul Gregg was a public embarrassment
to us all. I can’t figure out why Bill took Mr Gregg’s money to get
the club off Peter Johnson but not for the Kings Dock which as previously
stated will haunt Bill. He did employ David Moyes (also a recommendation
of SFX ,Paul Gregg’s firm) who has given us stability and a few highs
but has tested many of us with his style of football.
John
Woods and Robert Earl, I don’t really enough about our other
two major shareholders and what they do .I’m not sure how much time
John spends on Merseyside these days and Mr Earl lives in America and
has come to us it seems for the new stadium project, a bit like that
nasty Mr Gregg over the kings Dock. And look what happened to him!
Keith
Wyness, well again I’ll be honest he’s not my cup of tea from
my personal dealings with him. His behaviour over the plane cancellation
at Speke ,the Villarreal ticket fiasco, the ruthless ejection of long
term season ticket holders for corporate space and out pricing many
of our youngsters with the scrapping of the under elevens leaves a lot
to be desired. He is paid a Kings ransom in wages and for exactly what
I don’t know? As previously stated everything is sold or outsourced,
the two major sponsors we have were brought in by Paul Gregg and Andy
Hosie. Our turnover was heightened by sales and we have just lost in
excess of £11million. An Aberdeen fan not a Evertonian , where
does he care where the new stadium is. Will he be around to see the
consequences if we move to Kirkby? So I ask does he really care about
our fans?
Robert
Elston, our CEO number two, a really amiable guy who I recommend
if you want anything done at our club, he listens and implements.
Terry Leahy, an Evertonian and brilliant business man
for Tesco’s. The super stores CEO, remember not the owner, living around
Potter’s Bar, 200 miles away. I’m puzzled with Terry, I was led to believe
he would not get involved with Everton a couple of years ago but here
we are with him being the driving force of the project. A man well respected
around the business world BUT answerable to his shareholders. Again
has Terry been out of the City for too long to remember our passion
as the first club in the city. It’s been said to me that he is fed up
with Liverpool council and moving Everton out of the city is payback
time ,this can’t be true can it? I can’t see Tesco shareholders allowing
Terry to use his position because he has a fondness for us. No I think
its about what Tesco get out of the deal, ,free land and a retail complex
on the cheap BUT what about the cost of the stadium ? Will we get an
Emirates or a Kings Dock stadium in spec or something far more cheaply
and economic to the Tesco shareholders, again we’ll see .Every little
helps I suppose. For what its worth I’m told we will not have a bowl
shaped stadium but more in the line of FC Köln’s RheinEnergie Stadion
in Cologne.
Knowsley
Council, fair play to them they see this retail park as an
answer to many ills and a way forward .When Counsellor Eddie Connor
announced the deal to be proposed move on the day the Yanks took over
the reds was it deliberate? I mean they say slip in the bad news when
a far bigger story breaks. They are giving us everything it appears
to make the move happen. The whole area has been leafleted about the
positives that this development will bring them , but have they really
thought this out ? The proposed land was a landfill area , maybe were
getting the gas for free as well. Have they thought about having 5000
Mancs getting off Kirkby station and drinking in the locals waterholes
? One big disturbance in the town centre could scare the shoppers away
for some time ,there again this could happen anywhere .The new properties
on Cherry field Drive, are the owners really happy with what will welcome
them every morning and particularly on match day? I believe a local
pressure group has formed against the site ,again this could happen
anywhere . All the above stand to make money on their shares or bigger
wages if we go for the quick fix in Kirkby ,but what return will we
get from our hard earned money over the years of buying season tickets
etc ? A stadium so many of us do not want in this location.
The present
custodians are widely mistrusted by the fan base through past failures
to deliver and outright spin that insults your brain .The Fortress Sports
fund was a particularly sad fiasco .I thought Chris Samuelson was Phyllis
Fogg, he journeyed around the world that much to stamp approval for
this unique deal ,which by the way still had Bill at the helm. And some
of the investors originally stated sounded more like blue movie actors,
Robert Steel hammer was one. Was it just another smoke screen to stop
Paul Gregg acquiring the club? We may never know but yet another part
of our present custodian’s tenure that endorses the mistrust. Just watch
the spin in the coming months to the build up of the promised vote,
aided and abetted by the local media .
The build up to a fans vote will be like a presidential election circus
with promises of a free stadium, free land, everything made in profit
at the stadium will be ours and the best deal any club has ever been
offered (no the KD was), and we would be mad to ignore this offer of
a life time .I can imagine that the pies and drinks before the last
games before the life changing vote will become rare to find, cold and
staff levels minuscule for customers waiting around the stalls just
to make Kirkby look our new Utopia. Will we ever get a balanced view
again of our club when Trinity papers print our programmes and Everton
mags? Lets be honest were talking about being in bed together for pure
business scratching each other’s back so to speak .In the past the Echo
in particular have felt the scorn of the Everton to their cost now its
bed mate’s time .I have to ask the question will the anti Kirkby move
fans get the same space and oxygen as the Everton pr machine? Let’s
hope so, we’ll see. I know its dividing the fans once again and many
are fed up of it all ,it’s never an easy path for Evertonians of late.
Warren Bradley was quoted in an interview about our board that they
march you up to the top of the hill only to march you down again. I
had a wry smile at that quote only they want to march us out to Kirkby.
Can
we learn from other clubs who have moved to the outskirts?
Talking to Bolton fans they hate their stadium in Horwich on a similar
retail park proposed by us. Only the other day their director Phil Garside
was begging the fans to come back .They have lost over two thousand
fans this season on the average gate .Its seems the shiny gloss of when
it first opened has well gone with many fans opting to stay in the town
centre and watch the games on TV .
Man City fans are not in sync with their new free stadium and having
spoke to many of their fans they wish to be back at Maine Road, warts
and all rather than their soulless bowl, a fine stadium but lacking
that fortress homely feeling. They are trying everything to get fans
in, even £5 entry for kids. At the recent City away game I noticed
in big signs the statement ‘This is our City’; it was like a shout from
Custer’s last stand. Again the same theme with Derby’s new ground Pride
Park, always only two thirds full.
Southampton and Sunderland fans thought a new stadium cures your ills
and makes you go forward it sadly did the reverse for them. Interestingly
Coventry’s new Ricoh stadium was helped to be built by Tesco. This new
stadium is only a year old and already a white elephant (funny that
they have an elephant on their badge as well), crowds are no where near
what they expected for the football but the retail part is a success,
is that what we want? Incidentally Coventry’s ticket prices are unbelievably
cheap especially where the younger fans are concerned. http://www.ccfc.premiumtv.co.uk/page/MatchTickets/0,,10269,00.html
All the above clubs except for City are one horse towns and you would
think given every facility a football fan would want they would be there
in their droves, but its not the case .You could ague that its only
because their teams are not very good but wasn’t the new stadium built
to get a better team by way of the extra revenue?
Lets face the reality of it all whatever stadium we build in Kirkby
will it really get that much more revenue to challenge the top four
? No we need a billionaire on board to do this now and sadly not one
penny of real investment has come from our board only monies exchanged
for shares.
Were told our board is looking 24/7 for investment in our club ,well
they are not very good at it up to now in this take-over age or really
don’t want to dilute or share their ownership. Remember the ‘Fortress
Fund’ still allowed Bill to be at the helm.
Football is very tribal in its basics that’s were the passion is fuelled,
tell me what tribe opts to live on the outskirts of a city to be dominant
in any culture? I don’t want us to be thought of the Espanyol of Barcelona
I want us to be in our neighbours face in the city not cowering on the
outskirts.
When I look around at many of the new stadiums their corporate facilities
are never full,we can’t fill ours as it is .Again Everton could argue
that given better facilities they will come like in the film ‘Field
of dreams’, but where from ?Blue Chip companies only buy corporate facilities
where clubs have sustained success to entertain their customers .Now
given a choice to go to the new Castle Grey skull or the new Kirkby
stadium which one would they choose to invest ,it’s a harsh truth .We
can never sell out all our corporate consistently now no matter what
deal we offer. Our fans are in the main in the low income bracket and
I believe at saturation point in season ticket charges so a new stadium
to be filled would need a price decrease to accomplish this .So will
the extra revenue not be as projected?
Urban
myths: Kirkby, stadium and transport
This
is from Tom Hughes and the toffee web mailbag Unfortunately, I spent
6 years travelling between Kirkby and South Liverpool, using all the
various transport modes. While there, I was also involved in planning
and designing of the proposed tram system, so I am very familiar with
its transport network and particularly how it connects with Liverpool.
Transport Studies have been carried out to show that it is impossible
for Kirkby to accommodate the influx of people of the magnitude required;
that is why there is currently some urgency to get the trams back on
track so to speak. I can assure you that, even then Kirkby will not
possess anything like the public transport capacity of Walton, it is
simply demographically and logistically impossible. That is one of the
main reasons why even Liverpool FC, with their massive out-of-town support,
will not give up their more central location, run down or not. Goodison
Park has one of the fastest dispersal rates in the country... been to
the Reebok lately? Arsenal moved because they are massively successful
and they had thousands on waiting list for season tickets. Their turnover,
even at Highbury, was nearly 3 times ours. Even then they didn't opt
to move outside the M25; they stayed deep inside their catchment in
one of the most awkward places in the world to secure space. Liverpool
is full of brownfield sites, all far closer to central major transport
hubs than the peripheral Kirkby. Motorways play next to no part in modern
stadium planning; the Americans tried it in the 50-70's they're now
knocking them all down to move Downtown... but we're talking about going
to Kirkby... it beggers belief?!
What’s the answer and what can we do to stop moving to the outskirts?
Well to have a proper argument we need a viable alternative otherwise
we will come across as ludites who just want to bury our heads in the
pubs down County Road and moan about being able to afford so and so
in an ageing ground. We need to tick all the boxes for the majority
of fans to see an answer to our ills .Lets face it we can’t carry on
much longer at Goodison in its present state and expect to compete more.
There is only so much paint and cladding you can do to the old Lady.
It really irks me that the likes of Spurs and Villa have steadily kept
their grounds in good shape, added to them, and developed them, whilst
our custodians down the line have let Goodison get in this state. Our
neglect has been going on for more than twenty years not just Bill’s
tenure and were paying for it now. We pay top prices for seats with
restricted views that unless we play Brazilian football put many off
us going. We need funding from a partner or a sugar daddy ,I don’t think
a fans trust will work here on Merseyside for us but lets explore quickly
and once and for all end this idea one way or another. Let’s give Warren
Bradley a chance, forget the past with a seemingly unco-operative council
it’s about here and now and our future.
I know Bill’s Blue past with the boy’s pen etc but what about Warren’s
Everton credentials? Well I was told from a good friend that Warren
before the trip to Rotterdam was busy making a flag in his mum’s kitchen
and is a season ticket holder so I think he cares about us and was deeply
hurt that the city’s council under him is perceived as the baddies in
our future plans. It will be interesting that now the shared stadium
is off the Yankee agenda, a policy that various bodies in the city wanted
including Liverpool Vision and the Council .What will the City bodies
be seen to do to keep the first club in the city within the city boundaries,
losing valuable revenue, jobs and face for ever and a day by Evertonians.
There is a hell of a lot of work to be done quickly to stop Bill taking
us away from the city centre. Will any funding given to the reds be
matched and given to us? If we do Goodison up will it not be like building
a new ground, securing jobs locally and putting money into the local
economy? Let’s target the decision makers in the city, the blue chip
companies, the local MP’s .To do this we need a website that every concerned
Evertonian can have an input to aid our quest .Give ideas, have a task
to contact so and so. A small but ever growing group of us has already
had a fruitful meeting with Warren Bradley (more are planned) and are
in the process of contacting major captains of industry locally. Funding
will be given for a web site from the GFE to help not just stay at a
re-developed Goodison but a site if need be near the city centre .Sure
Liverpool council can’t give us free land but may help in other ways.
It was interesting to read from a fellow fan, Gavin, what he has found
already. Gavin says “I posted a short time ago about the growing rumours
of Tesco building a huge store as part of the Everton area redevelopment
just down the road at Great Homer Street. Has anyone thought about that
area being a site suitable for building a new stadium that stays within
walking distance of Goodison Park never mind within city limits?
A quick look at Google Earth or similar show a chunk of land big enough
dependent on the footprint for shops and housing knowing a lot of the
existing stuff is getting flattened and the transport access is as it
is right now. Maybe no free handouts from the council but surely I am
not the only one to think of this?”
Sheik Maktoum, I know a good Blue who rides for the family I’m sure
we could get a message to the Sheik to get back the family honour from
the abuse by the red infidels when they went back on their handshake.
Take us over and let battle commence eh?
Lord Grandchester, the Moores family have done an awful lot for the
cities institutions now may be the time to help the regions biggest
and longest institution Everton FC.I think this gentleman will be approached
soon.
There are nearly 600,000 Evertonians spread around the world, a fantastic
well of knowledge, its time this extended family was utilised to get
in touch with companies/people that could help. One of our newest fans
‘Rocky’ should get his contact book out for possible billionaires to
take us over. I think it would do Bill a favour if he could take his
money out and a little bit of interest like Paul Gregg and become just
a fan again. He often says he would gladly step aside for someone else,
he reiterated this at the last AGM
Conclusions
My conclusions on this particular proposed move are as follows. We seem
to be rushing it through as if the main players are trying to steal
something on us. Why the exclusivity clause in not being able to discuss
other options, is states to the fans this is the one they really want
no matter what we come up with or anyone else. The Kirkby project involves
knocking down a hell of a lot of buildings and relocating at least a
150 families at great cost plus building an infrastructure to make this
project work .Why then can this cost and commitment be made elsewhere
more fan friendly towards the city centre.
I keep
getting told it’s a done deal and what the fans want is insignificant.
Certain people will increase their share value without putting anything
into it as we will be told on the run in to the vote everything is for
nothing. Bill and his board are taking a hell of a risk in this proposal
with a fans backlash. If its to be believed that a director of our club,
stated at the last AGM, said to fans that they expect to lose twenty
per cent of the hardcore fans and gain ‘new’ fans from Lancashire they
are in for a shock and really don’t know our fans plus an insight to
what they really think of us .The 20% hardcore are the ones who follow
our club home and away, they will be there on a cold winters night in
the League cup when many will not. Especially a ‘new’ fan when the novelty
has worn off. And anyway Lancashire town clubs can’t get fans in for
love nor money just look at their gates, all traditional clubs with
proud histories.
Football attendances are falling except for the few, fans are leaving
for various reasons, and one is the cost .Just look at the visiting
section at our ground this season only a handful of teams sell out.
Fans are resentful of the wages of the players now and their loyalty,
why fund them anymore when you can watch any game down at the pub now
and get pleasantly drunk if you want on the entry fee at the ground
with no travelling costs. Fans are picking their live games ,the status
quo and predictably of the top four is getting to the other fans .All
we can realistically hope for is a cup run and we don’t even have them
anymore. It's not all doom and gloom while the match day experience
is still there ,the pub pre meets and after the game analysis Evertonians
will come and enjoy that bonding and live celebration of goals and controversy,
especially with a good side .But are we guarantee a good side with this
new ground ,no one can guarantee this.
The thought of having a modern bowl stadium with great views, easy parking,
food outlets etc does not disguise the fact that there is nothing pre-match
at the Reebok, Boro etc. The thought of spending pre-match at bloody
Tescos or Comet, B&Q etc is not one I look forward to.
I found this letter from another fan
Tesco’s, if they were wanting to help Everton they would be willing
to build the ground elsewhere but they are only interested in Kirkby
and no where else no matter what we want. It's obvious after the last
few months of debate on this issue that Everton have not pursued Liverpool
City Council to come up with a solution with any level of intensity.
Warren Bradley's words underlined that fact. The bottom line is that
Bill and Wyness are looking at Kirkby because it means they don't have
to look around for partners who could fund a state-of-the-art stadium-build
in the city. The Tesco/Knowsley route sees Bill and the rest of them
retaining control of the club. Whether the move to a stadium in Kirkby
(and away from the core of Liverpool's population) is a success or not
only time will tell. But that is one hell of a gamble for the chairman
of Everton FC to take with the future of the club he professes to love.
A protest could work if it involved 1000s on the streets or was drastic
like boycotting matches etc. But I don't think these things will happen
because we are a lazy lot, so many just can't be arsed. And the mass
of fans are very easy to manipulate, too. One or two well worded, well
placed articles in the press backed up by a few "legends"
are almost everyone will swallow it.
I’d like
to finish with a few words .I respect other fans views and I have only
had one fan at Reading away say the Kirkby deal was for him ,nearly
everyone I know is dead set against this proposed move .I really don’t
want to see Bill Kenwright hurt or be influenced for all the wrong reasons.
The move to knowsley is wrong for us at this moment in time. It’s not
like moving our own house and regretting the location later; we can
sell up again and move on. Mc Donald’s when giving franchises out ask
just three things, apart from the money, LOCATION, LOCATION, LOCATION.
Kirkby for many is the wrong location. Once we start building this stadium
in Kirkby there is no turning back, for most of us the rest of our lives
as Evertonians it will be our new home .I implore Bill to re-think this
and endeavour to work with the city council and Terry Leahy for other
sites nearer the city centre. If the will and funding to do Goodison
up is not there. Can you imagine Goodison being flattened and reds parking
their cars on it over the memories of our loved ones or a Superstore
there? I said to Bill at the last AGM “How do you want to be remembered
Bill”?
PLEASE DON’T DO IT BILL! Ian MacDonald (16/02/07)
Move On
I'm a blue
season ticket holder always have been always will be weather where in
Liverpool, Knowsley or the Lake District. Liverpool council go on about
what they offered Everton, not good enough or we would take it. EFC
don't care if fan's come or not they only care about money and moving
to Kirby with Tesco will make money end of story. People say stay in
Liverpool, so you'd like to stay at Goodison 2nd class stadium with
2nd class facility's and on top of it all those Arab's will move even
closer in a bigger and better stadium. Let's move away from them we
will still keep the fan base as where all mad and will travel anyway.
Stop moaning and face fact's EVERTON FOOTBALL CLUB WILL MOVE TO KIRBY
WEATHER YOU LIKE IT OR NOT. Dave the mighty blue. (26/01/07)
Four Options
A lot of
hot air has been spilt into the air since Kirkby entered the agenda.
First and foremost Goodison Park cannot stay as it is indefinitely,
something has to happen. Eventually we will be refused a safety certificate
in view of it's current structure (although safety in modern new build
stadiums are like Wigan's not particularly impressive). We have four
options the Kirkby option, begging Liverpool City Council for a site,
a ground share or re-development of Goodison.
A new ground as Middlesborough, Sunderland, Derby, Bolton and others
have found out is not instant success. The ground share is not on too
many people are against on all sides of the specture (to me it is better
than Kirkby but thats me), a new stadium in Liverpool we would have
to wait and wait and then perhaps not have the money to do anything
about it, this leads me back to Goodison.
Let me turn the argument around, should Everton leave Goodison what
do you think will happen to the land? Redevelopment with a capital R.
This will disrupt the immediate area in the same way as any redevelopment
of the Ground. The school and certain houses would be disrupted, but
there again so were the Mason sisters when the Kemlyn Road was rebuilt
at the tin mine.
The board need to start telling us the honest options and lets have
an open discussion, Everton surely would survive having capacity curtailed
to say 30,000 for two seasons. Or is that me thinking aloud.
Alex Langley (Upper Bullens S.Ticket holder) (17/02/07)
